XRAY - Model racing cars

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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 08:57:52 
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Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 05:52:13
Posts: 1335
Location: Trencin, Slovakia
All new parts will be soon posted on the web however now XRAY had to finish all main projects like new XB808 2011 car, NT1 2011 car and new RX8.


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 08:05:27 
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Joined: Wed Jun 30, 2010 00:29:32
Posts: 14
I'm glad to hear that there's been a lot of focus on all the new cars coming out, but this car is over a year old and is still in need of some general tuning parts.

Now that I have some aftermarket parts on it (team tamale aluminum knuckles, rear bulkheads that allow any manufactures ride height spacers as well as lowering motor position, and a crc center shock) i have a fully adjustable, very competitive car.

It's good to see some parts coming from Xray though, it'll be easier to promote the car to other drivers. Right now, at least in my neck of the woods (Canada), the impression people have in their minds about Xray and their pan cars is that they're not important. I know at least 2 people gave up waiting on parts and sold their XII.

But hey, this is my opinion, I've been running the car for around 5 months now, and am super happy with the end result.

Managed to finish 6th in the A-main in the 2011 Canadian Onroad Nationals.

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 12:41:17 
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Joined: Sat Nov 18, 2006 00:14:36
Posts: 52
Location: Finland
Peakki wrote:
I think that the link car needs following:
-Shorter lipo only chassis. Shorter from the front, between body post and arms. This to avoid scrubbing to carpet. Good idea would be like in a V-Dezign 4.0 car.
-More tuning options (side spring, center shock spring)
-More rear ride height parts, with 0.25/0.5mm difference. It's a shame that you can't run below 42.5mm tires with this without aftermarket parts.
-A bit wider rear pod - everyone seems to run with the max 172mm (or near it).
-Lowered center shock position. This can be done by using part #373072 and with 1mm shim.
-Maybe possibility to remove play from front arms by screw&nut (like in CRC, Serpent, etc.)
-Shorter side links with smaller balls - For smoother suspension action.
Well that was more than five :wink:

Today was my first packs with the car. I really like the quality and metric stuff in general.

Things to keep:
-Diff with thrust bearing
-Open but strong rear pod
-Front end that doesn't need dremel to put it together. 8)


After one winter season with the car, some conclusions:

-Front end is easy to put together, but it has a bit more slop than there is needed.
-Front end doesn't scrub that much, but if you are running on a bumpy track a shorter front overhang chassis would be nice.
-Car is better to drive after dremeling steering blocks shorter.
-Stiffer chassis is definetely needed! I had to buy an aftermarket one to keep all 4 wheels to the ground.
-Different weight bias for lipo batteries. The center pivot should be more towards to the front archive this as also wheelbase should be longer (around 200mm, not about 193mm as it is now).
-More rear ride height parts, with 0.25/0.5mm difference to drive with race size tires (42-43mm). I took 0.75mm material off from rear bulkheads.
-More 64Dp spur gears, sizes 90-100 would be nice. The original spur gear (96T) is durable and very good otherwise. Maybe new ones with holes for 16 balls... :wink:
-Holes to mount a micro servo would be nice
-Bumbsteering can be taken away by using about 4-4,5mm shims on steering block. Without this, the car is too difficult and unpredictable to drive.
-Side spring position could be better - spring against a moving link isn't so accurate as a spring against rear pod CF. A new chassis and rear pod layout needed and link brace for that :wink:
-Wider front track would be really nice. This car is hard to drive maybe because it is narrower than 165mm in the front. So mouting positions for fronts arms to wider.

Side and center springs are now available, that is good. Stiffer center springs helped a lot.

But anyway here are my thoughts that someone in the R&D should check out.

Carpet season starts soon. I can't wait! 8)


Last edited by Peakki on Fri Sep 02, 2011 14:02:54, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 18:28:27 
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 19:46:34
Posts: 8
Location: Denmark
Agree with Peakki on all suggestions ... also see the earlier posted notes on possible improvements in this thread.

A couple more to check out:

A lover front arm (the current one is made for the previous 2.0 mm T-bar chassis), so we can drive the front wheels all the way down. 0.5 - 0.75 mm would bee fine.

Rear bulkheads lowered 0.5-0.75 mm (the current ones is made for the previous 2.0 mm T-bar chassis) ... there are room for 0.75 mm, but 0.5 mm would be fine :)

Many other manufactores seem to come with updated cars with a longer wheelbase ... plase check this out in combination with a more optimal weightdistrubution front/rear specifically for lipo.

Steering blocks in different hights maybe ... in 0.5 mm increments ... or with markings for cutoff.

About 2 mm longer ball studs for the steering blocks ... so it can be go all the way through when screewed in (with +4,5 shims).

Front Ride Height adjusteres in carbon (or aluminium) with 0.25 mm increments ... glad to see an all in one adjuster that can bee set in place without having to remove the bolts that attach the front, but only loosened. And please with the well known presicion of Yray, so there would bee minimal slup when installed, and with at presice and snug fit :)

And (eventually as an option) for the dreamers ... an Xray rearend that stands out and really works ... eventually inspired by the one from C Andy ... but CNCmilled the way that only Xray can do it :D

And last, but not least ... Keep the current good, stylish, high quality and precise X-ray layout all around.

Kind regards; Jens


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 15:51:55 
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 19:46:34
Posts: 8
Location: Denmark
Dear XRAY

The indoor season begins soon - around october 1st - hopefully there are ongoing work with a new seriously updated XII ... but when will it come? Cant wait until february, and hopefully not many weeks after the new indoor season is begon.

Is it possible to get an estimated week?

Kind regards; Jens


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 04:36:10 
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Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 18:09:41
Posts: 66
Location: Tennessee
I think you guys will be happy with the new changes. Been doing a lot of testing the past few months in preparation for carpet with the 12th scale. Going to one final test this weekend for an IIC Vegas warmup race.

EA


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 16:02:09 
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 19:46:34
Posts: 8
Location: Denmark
Possible tunig aid for XII ...

In the set-up database for XII it seems that the steering blocks are beeing milled down 1,5-2 mm to get rid of camber gain.

Would it be possible to get the same effect, if the Front Upper Arm Mount was 1,5-2,0 mm higher?

If it is, then here is a subject for a new tuning aid ... a "high version" of the Front Upper Arm Mount. Then we would not have to modifi the steering blocks manually :)

Jens


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 09:59:03 
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Joined: Sat Nov 18, 2006 00:14:36
Posts: 52
Location: Finland
Some thoughts about X12 possible improvements:
1. Longer 4,2mm ballstuds for steering blocks - with 3,4-4,5mm shim the current ballstuds doesn't have enough thread--> if you crash, you'll strip only the threads from the block but otherwise block is good as new.
2. Lower front arms to have more ride height with small tires.
3. Motor has to be moved more than the current motor bulkhead allows. See attachment for example
4. Shorter and narrower chassis. Shorter from the front, between body post and arms. This to avoid scrubbing to carpet. Good idea would be like in a V-Dezign 5 car.
5. Maybe possibility to remove play from front arms by screw&nut (like in CRC, Serpent, etc.)
6. More 64Dp spur gears, sizes 90-100 would be nice. The original spur gear (96T) is durable and very good otherwise. New ones with holes for 16 balls for more time between rebuilds!
7. Longer front upper arm for more corner speed - now have to dremel and use shims
8. Holes to mount a micro servo (Sanwa ERG-HR for example)

Things I like:
Chassis which is stiff enough
Tubes
Rear pod
Diff is superb - could have less slop between d-ring and diff outdrives though
Durability and quality!


Attachments:
motormount.jpg
motormount.jpg [ 43.7 KiB | Viewed 9556 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 19:05:42 
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Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2007 19:46:34
Posts: 8
Location: Denmark
Sure there is room for further improvement on the X12.

- The longer ballstuds have has been wanted for a couple of years, and 2-3 mm longer is needed
- Or move the arm on the blocks a couple of mm up could also a solution, but the longer ballstud will give more flexibility in the set-up of the car.
- The lower front arms have been requested since we got the 2,5 mm chassis with the XII-link car. The current arms worked fine with the first 2,0 mm chassis for the first XII, but are too high for the newer and current chassis ... about 0,75 mm lower would be fine, and there is room for it.
- Indeed a 1,0 to 2,0 mm narrower chassis in the front would be appreciated for tracks with tight 180 degree turns. There is a big difference in using ex. jaco tyres and matrix tyres, and matrix tyre gives about 1,25 mm narrower width in the front. And CRC and BSR tyres are out of the question, because they have about 1,5-2,0 mm wider in the front than ex. jaco.
- A solution with adjustable front width +/1 1 mm on each side would be the optimal solution. Serpent has it, but a nice cleaner xray solution would be very wellcomed.
- Theres a lot of play in the front of the car, and solutions that remove more play would be appreciated.
- An optional upper front arm making the front upper arm longer for more corner speed would also be appreciated
- Holes to mount the smallest micro servos
- Other placement of the screw for the batteryholders, so they are placed in front of the batteryholder instead of now on the side. It will make the barretyholder more crashproof, because the load will be on the stronger screw and not as now on the little plastic pin on the batteryholder.

Best wishes; Jens


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 02:29:27 
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Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 20:27:54
Posts: 46
Some of these things have been mentioned, some have not:

Front End -

1. Eliminate the slop - especially with the lower arm and pivot ball. The pivot ball moves up and down in the arm anywhere from 1-2mm, this is basically front droop that we can't remove and is a flaw.

2. Adjustable Upper Arm length - yes we can shave/dremel the nub on the upright, but this shouldn't be the case. This is a highly used tuning feature in both stock and mod. As designed, there is too much camber gain in the stock configuration.

3. Adjustable Track Width - nuff said - this car is wide at the front.

4. Thicker steering blocks - at the point of contact of the ballstud. Instead of making longer ballstuds, make the steering block thicker by 3mm. Look at the AE steering blocks as an example. Right now it is necessary to add a minimum of 3mm of shims to get close to removing bumpsteer, with 5mm being more common.

4. Adjustable center brace - to use with long arm setups. The stock carbon brace is useless when you make the arms longer.

Chassis

1. Narrow the chassis

2. Battery position - allow for transverse (more weight transfer when needed) as well as inline configurations.

3. Shock Mount Position - allow for multiple mount points toward front of car.

Rear Pod

1. Move shock mount toward the front of car with a longer top pod plate.

Bulkheads

1. Longer slots - allow for more motor movement - 76T spur with 60 pinion - typical in US.

2. Adjustable Ride Height without plastic inserts - Team Tamale Pod is the best example.

Graphite Axle

1. Better design - axle bends at pin point where plate is mounted - use larger threads - look at IRS axles.

2. Standard D-Ring - not sure why this isn't used.

Innovation

1. Bellcrank - as servo turns, vertical height of turnbuckles changes, and results in different bump toe at each wheel.


I hope Xray will give 1/12 racing the attention it deserves, it's been around for a very long time.


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 04:28:04 
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Location: Edwardsville, IL USA
Front end like on the Serpent or CRC! Adding shims to different parts of the king pin is rediculous


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 16:26:25 
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Joined: Sat Nov 18, 2006 00:14:36
Posts: 52
Location: Finland
Rear pivot point moved forward and transverse battery config - for more constancy to lap times and to make the car easier to drive fast.

And new front end without slop and crazy droop (lower arm&ball problem has to be taken care of).


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 13:45:45 
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:48:40
Posts: 1328
Location: Windsor, UK
Biggest problem I have found lately is trying to prevent the battery from moving after a crash.

When mounted transversely, the battery has play from side to side and after a crash can easily move forward as there are no 'stops' etc to prevent this.

Some holes so we can mount the T4 battery stops would probably do.

Perhaps a way of holding the battery in place like CRC use, the large rubber band as this was far easier to use (I owned a CRC Xi before)

Skiddins


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 16:45:47 
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:48:40
Posts: 1328
Location: Windsor, UK
After reading some of the team drivers setups, thay have dremeled some of the caster blocks to allow the fitting of washers to make the top links longer.

See this question to see what I mean;
http://forum.teamxray.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=18607

It would be nice to have some pre made shims that would allow this adjustment to be made simply by unscrewing the blocks and then inserting the spacers, a bit like the front ride height spacers.

Skiddins


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:44:34 
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:48:40
Posts: 1328
Location: Windsor, UK
A way of securing the lipo without using cell tape would be nice as well (Also applies to the X1)


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 Post subject: Re: XRAY Wants You!
PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:33:13 
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Location: Windsor, UK
With the latest tyres having to be run very small to be competitive, having front end lower arms that have less of an upward angle on them etc so that the front end can have useful ride height with smaller tyres.


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